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Convocatorias Postdocs


Convocatoria de ayudas a la captación de talento investigador EMERGIA 2020

mensajes: 11

El verano pasado (2020) la Junta de Andalucia convoco las ayudas a la captacion de talento investigador EMERGIA 2020

https://www.juntadeandalucia.es/servicios/procedimientos/detalle/22250/datos-basicos.html

No he encontrado ninguna entrada sobre el tema EMERGIA en ningun foro de precarios.org.

Presente mi proyecto en esta convocatoria.

Me preguntaba si alguien en este foro tambien presento propuesta de proyecto en esta convocatoria.

Me extraña que casi todas las convocatorias de postdoc o atraccion de talento son comentadas en este foro, pero esta en concreto, EMERGIA, no tenga entrada, quiza me no la he encontrado.

Muchas gracias.

mensajes: 56

El proyecto sólo se evaluaba a partir de 55 en el CV, creo recordar. En la convocatoria lo ponía.

Yo tengo el mismo comentario sobre la captación de recursos siendo mentira. También me pasó con las Ikerbasque, así que eso de rellenar la evaluación con frases de galletitas de la fortuna después de haber decidido los ganadores lo hacen en todas partes. Es cierto que luego hay otros comentarios que son acertados, pero sigue jodiendo bastante.

A mí lo que me han comentado es que en algunos casos de proyectos competitivos como las MSCA-IF, al ir con un supervisor asociado, no te consideran como que hayas sido PI de nada ni que hayas conseguido tú los recursos, aunque el proyecto lo escribieras tú solo y lo llevaras a cabo tú solo. En fin, esto es España, para qué discutir si ya sabemos cómo va esto.

JonSnow wrote:

Correcto. en mi caso justo debajo de ese ID @aries aparece una linea con un pdf donde aparece el informe, pero solo del CV. Creo que en tu caso puede estar relacionado con la firma electrónica.

Entiendo que primero deciden y luego puntuan. Lo gracioso es que en ese mismo informe, una linea mas arriba reconocenn que soy PI de un proyecto competitivo internacional. Osea soy PI de un proyecto de 300,000 euros, pero no he acreditado la captación de recursos? En fin... Esto es lo de menos, solo que me ha dolido la puntuación en el apartado de lidership.

Saludos,

mensajes: 8


Correcto. en mi caso justo debajo de ese ID @aries aparece una linea con un pdf donde aparece el informe, pero solo del CV. Creo que en tu caso puede estar relacionado con la firma electrónica.

Entiendo que primero deciden y luego puntuan. Lo gracioso es que en ese mismo informe, una linea mas arriba reconocenn que soy PI de un proyecto competitivo internacional. Osea soy PI de un proyecto de 300,000 euros, pero no he acreditado la captación de recursos? En fin... Esto es lo de menos, solo que me ha dolido la puntuación en el apartado de lidership.

Saludos,

JonSnow wrote:

Gracias, lo suponia, pero no me aperece ningun informe, en cambio me pide algun numero o identificacion de proyecto: Id @ries

de todos modos he leido en el email que nos mandaron:

'el informe de evaluación, que podrá consultar en la dirección de internet https://sica2.cica.es , accediendo con su usuario y clave de SICA. En caso de no estar disponible dicho informe de evaluación en la citada dirección, podrá solicitarlo por correo electrónico a la siguiente dirección de correo electrónico: svpai.dgitc.cteicu en juntadeandalucia.es'

he tenido la suerte de que mi evaluacion no este disponible, quiza es porque he enviado la solucitud desde el extranjero, no tengo firma electronica o similar.

los informes de los no seleccionados los escriben con monos lanzando dardos a las distintas opciones, en una ocasion reciente me evaluaron diciendo que no tenia experiencia internacional (2 años en UK y 6 en Alemania).

JonSnow wrote:

Los comentarios sobre el CV los encuentras en Convocatorias - Emergia - Fase: Evaluación - Candidatos En curso

También está abierta una fase de alegaciones, por si alguien se anima. A mi en los comentarios del CV me han puesto

"no queda acreditada la capacidad de captación de recursos como investigador principal de proyectos de investigación en convocatorias competitivas tanto nacionales como internacionales"

lo cual es objetivamente falso, tal y como está claramente escrito en mi CV. Pero en fin, tampoco voy a entrar a alegar ni nada por el estilo.

mensajes: 11

Gracias, lo suponia, pero no me aperece ningun informe, en cambio me pide algun numero o identificacion de proyecto: Id @ries

de todos modos he leido en el email que nos mandaron:

'el informe de evaluación, que podrá consultar en la dirección de internet https://sica2.cica.es , accediendo con su usuario y clave de SICA. En caso de no estar disponible dicho informe de evaluación en la citada dirección, podrá solicitarlo por correo electrónico a la siguiente dirección de correo electrónico: svpai.dgitc.cteicu en juntadeandalucia.es'

he tenido la suerte de que mi evaluacion no este disponible, quiza es porque he enviado la solucitud desde el extranjero, no tengo firma electronica o similar.

los informes de los no seleccionados los escriben con monos lanzando dardos a las distintas opciones, en una ocasion reciente me evaluaron diciendo que no tenia experiencia internacional (2 años en UK y 6 en Alemania).

JonSnow wrote:

Los comentarios sobre el CV los encuentras en Convocatorias - Emergia - Fase: Evaluación - Candidatos En curso

También está abierta una fase de alegaciones, por si alguien se anima. A mi en los comentarios del CV me han puesto

"no queda acreditada la capacidad de captación de recursos como investigador principal de proyectos de investigación en convocatorias competitivas tanto nacionales como internacionales"

lo cual es objetivamente falso, tal y como está claramente escrito en mi CV. Pero en fin, tampoco voy a entrar a alegar ni nada por el estilo.

mensajes: 8


Los comentarios sobre el CV los encuentras en Convocatorias -> Emergia -> Fase: Evaluación - Candidatos En curso

También está abierta una fase de alegaciones, por si alguien se anima. A mi en los comentarios del CV me han puesto

"no queda acreditada la capacidad de captación de recursos como investigador principal de proyectos de investigación en convocatorias competitivas tanto nacionales como internacionales"

lo cual es objetivamente falso, tal y como está claramente escrito en mi CV. Pero en fin, tampoco voy a entrar a alegar ni nada por el estilo.

mensajes: 11

perdona, en que parte de la web del sica puedes encontrar los comentarios sobre el CV?

JonSnow wrote:

Hola a todos,
Sin entrar en los detalles de cómo se ha evaluado a los candidatos, en la web del sica solo me aparecen los comentarios referentes a mi CV, pero no he encontrado nada sobre la valoración del proyecto. No sé si directamente al no llegar a un mínimo del puntuación del CV (50/70) este ya ni se evalua, o si el feedback del proyecto se publicará más tarde.

Saludos

mensajes: 8

Hola a todos,
Sin entrar en los detalles de cómo se ha evaluado a los candidatos, en la web del sica solo me aparecen los comentarios referentes a mi CV, pero no he encontrado nada sobre la valoración del proyecto. No sé si directamente al no llegar a un mínimo del puntuación del CV (50/70) este ya ni se evalua, o si el feedback del proyecto se publicará más tarde.

Saludos

mensajes: 3

Hi All,
I want to thank you all contributing to the discussion during the period. Thank to here, I get some ideas about what we should expect, and after the last messages I do not feel myself very desparate for giving a worthless proposal.

I wish you all the best and hope healthy and motivated future.

danny_m wrote:

Pues muy bien conocer la lista, pero yo espero que se publique o se comunique a los solicitantes la puntuación de las solicitudes y la posición global en el ranking, como se hace en las RyC.

No me he molestado en comparar los CV de seleccionados+reservas vs no seleccionados, pero al menos veo que en mi área los seleccionados tienen mejores métricas (citas, índice H) que yo, aunque esperaba ver mejores revistas (aunque es verdad que tampoco voy a quejarme de eso cuando soy de los primeros críticos con la tontería del impact factor y demás). Por nombre no me suena nadie de mi área, así que no sabría decir si hay algún tongo escandaloso.

Por otra parte, yo tengo ya muy poca fe en convocatorias regionales. Me fío más de las RyC. Y de todas formas, tengo claro que cada convocatoria es una lotería según los evaluadores que toquen, al igual que colar un paper en tal o cual revista.

Habrá que "seguir rascando". Me queda el consuelo de que no han tardado tanto en publicar esto como temía, entre la pandemia y las costumbres de la Junta me temía que nos íbamos a Junio para saber algo.

mensajes: 56

Pues muy bien conocer la lista, pero yo espero que se publique o se comunique a los solicitantes la puntuación de las solicitudes y la posición global en el ranking, como se hace en las RyC.

No me he molestado en comparar los CV de seleccionados+reservas vs no seleccionados, pero al menos veo que en mi área los seleccionados tienen mejores métricas (citas, índice H) que yo, aunque esperaba ver mejores revistas (aunque es verdad que tampoco voy a quejarme de eso cuando soy de los primeros críticos con la tontería del impact factor y demás). Por nombre no me suena nadie de mi área, así que no sabría decir si hay algún tongo escandaloso.

Por otra parte, yo tengo ya muy poca fe en convocatorias regionales. Me fío más de las RyC. Y de todas formas, tengo claro que cada convocatoria es una lotería según los evaluadores que toquen, al igual que colar un paper en tal o cual revista.

Habrá que "seguir rascando". Me queda el consuelo de que no han tardado tanto en publicar esto como temía, entre la pandemia y las costumbres de la Junta me temía que nos íbamos a Junio para saber algo.

mensajes: 76

Cierto, han apostado por ciertas subareas muy concretas. Podrian haberlo dicho en la convocatoria, con requisitos:

1) Que tu area sea exactamente una de aquellas donde nuestros peces gordos de la DEVA trabajen.
2) Que seais socios de la misma caseta de la feria de Sevilla.
3) Que sepas hacer bien cafe y no te quejes por dar problemas y practicas de laboratorio de 4 asignaturas distintas porque al jefe no le da la gana.

Bueno, en nuestro caso los mejores CV estan todos fuera de seleccionados y reserva. Imagino que para no haya lugar a protestas con sustancia. Que se premie el calientasillismo es una cosa increible, pero en Andalucia todo es posible. (que conste que soy andaluz, eh, no ze ballai a penza que zoi un rasihta).

jp3 wrote:

es una pena que la estrategia de seleccion haya sido mayoritariamente de retencion o retorno de talento. Me imagino que el comite de seleccion ha entendido que el sistema andaluz de investigacion necesita reforzar ciertas lineas de investigacion preferente y han apostado por los candidatos que mejor se ajustaban a esa necesidad. Casi todos los cv de los aplicantes son del mismo order de calidad, al menos los 20 primeros, asi que es una cuestion de suerte a quien eligen, quiza alguien del comite es de tu campo y apuesta fuerte por ti, etc.... Respecto a mi caso particular, el año pasado estuve a punto de recibir una RyC (reserva a solo unas pocas posiciones de ser seleccionado), pero en esta lista mi posicion esta muy alejada de de los primeros puestos, y cerca de los ultimos. Intuyo que los criterios de seleccion de la RyC son bien distintos a los del programa Emergia.

jp3 wrote:

Bueno yo estoy deseando ver como me han evaluado el proyecto. Porque jetas son, pero tontos no. Y con evaluarte el proyecto como una basura tienen bastante, y pueden darte de CV el maximo. Asi no te puedes quejar.

Que tal ha salido en tu area?

jp3 wrote:

Madre mia ¿y esto es una convocatoria de atraccion de talento internacional? Ver para creer. Desde luego a mas de uno se le deberia caer la cara de vergüenza porque en la RyC es cierto que los "ganadores" tienen CVs brillantes pero lo de esto es para echarse a llorar de la impotencia.

jp3 wrote:

Y no es que quede el consuelo de "bueno, por lo menos se caen de la lista de RyC unos cuantos y hay mas posibilidades". Ja! Porque a los que se lo han dado (en mi area al menos) ni llegan a reserva en RyC, ni han llegado nunca, ni nunca llegaran (ni llegarian). Yo tenia mis sospechas de que hubiera algunos pequeños intereses cortijeros, pero esto es de risa. Pues eso, Andalucia es mucha Andalucia, y aqui me habia creido yo que tenian intencion de mejorar el sistema. Que pardillo que soy.

Ea, a currar.

jp3 wrote:

Hombre hombre hombre, Andalucia a lo suyo. Vaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaya tongazo colega. Pero sin despeinarse eh. Con to la puta cara.

mensajes: 11

es una pena que la estrategia de seleccion haya sido mayoritariamente de retencion o retorno de talento. Me imagino que el comite de seleccion ha entendido que el sistema andaluz de investigacion necesita reforzar ciertas lineas de investigacion preferente y han apostado por los candidatos que mejor se ajustaban a esa necesidad. Casi todos los cv de los aplicantes son del mismo order de calidad, al menos los 20 primeros, asi que es una cuestion de suerte a quien eligen, quiza alguien del comite es de tu campo y apuesta fuerte por ti, etc.... Respecto a mi caso particular, el año pasado estuve a punto de recibir una RyC (reserva a solo unas pocas posiciones de ser seleccionado), pero en esta lista mi posicion esta muy alejada de de los primeros puestos, y cerca de los ultimos. Intuyo que los criterios de seleccion de la RyC son bien distintos a los del programa Emergia.

jp3 wrote:

Bueno yo estoy deseando ver como me han evaluado el proyecto. Porque jetas son, pero tontos no. Y con evaluarte el proyecto como una basura tienen bastante, y pueden darte de CV el maximo. Asi no te puedes quejar.

Que tal ha salido en tu area?

jp3 wrote:

Madre mia ¿y esto es una convocatoria de atraccion de talento internacional? Ver para creer. Desde luego a mas de uno se le deberia caer la cara de vergüenza porque en la RyC es cierto que los "ganadores" tienen CVs brillantes pero lo de esto es para echarse a llorar de la impotencia.

jp3 wrote:

Y no es que quede el consuelo de "bueno, por lo menos se caen de la lista de RyC unos cuantos y hay mas posibilidades". Ja! Porque a los que se lo han dado (en mi area al menos) ni llegan a reserva en RyC, ni han llegado nunca, ni nunca llegaran (ni llegarian). Yo tenia mis sospechas de que hubiera algunos pequeños intereses cortijeros, pero esto es de risa. Pues eso, Andalucia es mucha Andalucia, y aqui me habia creido yo que tenian intencion de mejorar el sistema. Que pardillo que soy.

Ea, a currar.

jp3 wrote:

Hombre hombre hombre, Andalucia a lo suyo. Vaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaya tongazo colega. Pero sin despeinarse eh. Con to la puta cara.

mensajes: 11

Pues por lo que veo han dado las cosas segun numero de articulos al peso dando igual la calidad.

jp3 wrote:

Bueno yo estoy deseando ver como me han evaluado el proyecto. Porque jetas son, pero tontos no. Y con evaluarte el proyecto como una basura tienen bastante, y pueden darte de CV el maximo. Asi no te puedes quejar.

Que tal ha salido en tu area?

jp3 wrote:

Madre mia ¿y esto es una convocatoria de atraccion de talento internacional? Ver para creer. Desde luego a mas de uno se le deberia caer la cara de vergüenza porque en la RyC es cierto que los "ganadores" tienen CVs brillantes pero lo de esto es para echarse a llorar de la impotencia.

jp3 wrote:

Y no es que quede el consuelo de "bueno, por lo menos se caen de la lista de RyC unos cuantos y hay mas posibilidades". Ja! Porque a los que se lo han dado (en mi area al menos) ni llegan a reserva en RyC, ni han llegado nunca, ni nunca llegaran (ni llegarian). Yo tenia mis sospechas de que hubiera algunos pequeños intereses cortijeros, pero esto es de risa. Pues eso, Andalucia es mucha Andalucia, y aqui me habia creido yo que tenian intencion de mejorar el sistema. Que pardillo que soy.

Ea, a currar.

jp3 wrote:

Hombre hombre hombre, Andalucia a lo suyo. Vaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaya tongazo colega. Pero sin despeinarse eh. Con to la puta cara.

mensajes: 76

Bueno yo estoy deseando ver como me han evaluado el proyecto. Porque jetas son, pero tontos no. Y con evaluarte el proyecto como una basura tienen bastante, y pueden darte de CV el maximo. Asi no te puedes quejar.

Que tal ha salido en tu area?

jp3 wrote:

Madre mia ¿y esto es una convocatoria de atraccion de talento internacional? Ver para creer. Desde luego a mas de uno se le deberia caer la cara de vergüenza porque en la RyC es cierto que los "ganadores" tienen CVs brillantes pero lo de esto es para echarse a llorar de la impotencia.

jp3 wrote:

Y no es que quede el consuelo de "bueno, por lo menos se caen de la lista de RyC unos cuantos y hay mas posibilidades". Ja! Porque a los que se lo han dado (en mi area al menos) ni llegan a reserva en RyC, ni han llegado nunca, ni nunca llegaran (ni llegarian). Yo tenia mis sospechas de que hubiera algunos pequeños intereses cortijeros, pero esto es de risa. Pues eso, Andalucia es mucha Andalucia, y aqui me habia creido yo que tenian intencion de mejorar el sistema. Que pardillo que soy.

Ea, a currar.

jp3 wrote:

Hombre hombre hombre, Andalucia a lo suyo. Vaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaya tongazo colega. Pero sin despeinarse eh. Con to la puta cara.

mensajes: 11

Madre mia ¿y esto es una convocatoria de atraccion de talento internacional? Ver para creer. Desde luego a mas de uno se le deberia caer la cara de vergüenza porque en la RyC es cierto que los "ganadores" tienen CVs brillantes pero lo de esto es para echarse a llorar de la impotencia.

jp3 wrote:

Y no es que quede el consuelo de "bueno, por lo menos se caen de la lista de RyC unos cuantos y hay mas posibilidades". Ja! Porque a los que se lo han dado (en mi area al menos) ni llegan a reserva en RyC, ni han llegado nunca, ni nunca llegaran (ni llegarian). Yo tenia mis sospechas de que hubiera algunos pequeños intereses cortijeros, pero esto es de risa. Pues eso, Andalucia es mucha Andalucia, y aqui me habia creido yo que tenian intencion de mejorar el sistema. Que pardillo que soy.

Ea, a currar.

jp3 wrote:

Hombre hombre hombre, Andalucia a lo suyo. Vaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaya tongazo colega. Pero sin despeinarse eh. Con to la puta cara.

mensajes: 76

Y no es que quede el consuelo de "bueno, por lo menos se caen de la lista de RyC unos cuantos y hay mas posibilidades". Ja! Porque a los que se lo han dado (en mi area al menos) ni llegan a reserva en RyC, ni han llegado nunca, ni nunca llegaran (ni llegarian). Yo tenia mis sospechas de que hubiera algunos pequeños intereses cortijeros, pero esto es de risa. Pues eso, Andalucia es mucha Andalucia, y aqui me habia creido yo que tenian intencion de mejorar el sistema. Que pardillo que soy.

Ea, a currar.

jp3 wrote:

Hombre hombre hombre, Andalucia a lo suyo. Vaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaya tongazo colega. Pero sin despeinarse eh. Con to la puta cara.

mensajes: 76

Cierto que es una teoría conspiranoica.

Ahora bien, en la resolución que acaba de salir se menciona explícitamente que las solicitudes ya han sido evaluadas. O sea que ya mihmito tenemo la rezolusion.

{QUOTE(thread_id=>123054)}Asi es. Si tuviera que apostar diria que todavia ni se han leido las solicitudes. El resto son teorias conspirativas sin ningun fundamento que ademas no tienen ni pies ni cabeza.

berlin-to-spain wrote:
berlin-to-spain wrote:

I have never heard of such things happening systematically, especially here is Spain. The only similar thing I have heard of is some evaluator leaking the results to some applicants, but happening at particular level and completely independently from the organism, since it would be a huge breach of confidenciality. Here in Spain the procedures involve many steps, first they publish a provisional list of awardees, then there is a time for allegations/revisions where some awardee could decline, then there is another list of awardess where there may be some reserve candidates, and maybe yet another definitive list. Here in Spain the organisms don't care at all about the speed of the process or "prestige" of the calls, if half the candidates fail to sign the contracts then that money is lost (I mean, the organism simply "saves it") and that's it. If they would care about such things, the situation of science in Spain would be much different.

berlin-to-spain wrote:

I suspect that probably selected candidates have been already contacted before publishing the first list is because in other regional calls (I had also this experience at international level) this is exactly what happens. Funding agency asks the candidates whether or not are willing to accept the grant, some of them reject the grant right away, so the funding agency can contact the rest of candidates, and speed up the process of hiring or allocating the grants. This way most of the people granted and appearing in the first list will accept the grant, meaning that they can show how attractive the grant is. This is an official mean to comunicate the results but it is of course not public. In comparison to many other similar calls, after publishing the definitive list of candidates and positions allocated to each centre, it takes little for the publication of the list of awardees.
This is why my feeling is that grantees have been or will be soon contacted officially but privately.
Unfortunately, I do not know anyone working in science in Andalucia to ask. I hope there will be more calls in the near future, it would make no sense to stop this program. However, I believe that there will be some kind of filter (like a co-funding host) in order to reduce the number of applicants.


berlin-to-spain wrote:

Hi Berlin-to-Spain,
I don't quite get the why the winners must have been already contacted. Did the convocatoria say something about a maximum date to publish the results (sorry I don't remember having read that), or do you know somebody who has been unofficially told that he or she has been selected.

Thanks,

berlin-to-spain wrote:

six months have passed since the deadline of the call.
I suspect that in order to speed up paperwork, etc... 'winners' have been already contacted by whoever is in charge of this call.
I bet the final list will come out after Easter, hopefully back-to-back with the new call.

mensajes: 11

Asi es. Si tuviera que apostar diria que todavia ni se han leido las solicitudes. El resto son teorias conspirativas sin ningun fundamento que ademas no tienen ni pies ni cabeza.

{QUOTE(thread_id=>123052)}

berlin-to-spain wrote:

I have never heard of such things happening systematically, especially here is Spain. The only similar thing I have heard of is some evaluator leaking the results to some applicants, but happening at particular level and completely independently from the organism, since it would be a huge breach of confidenciality. Here in Spain the procedures involve many steps, first they publish a provisional list of awardees, then there is a time for allegations/revisions where some awardee could decline, then there is another list of awardess where there may be some reserve candidates, and maybe yet another definitive list. Here in Spain the organisms don't care at all about the speed of the process or "prestige" of the calls, if half the candidates fail to sign the contracts then that money is lost (I mean, the organism simply "saves it") and that's it. If they would care about such things, the situation of science in Spain would be much different.

berlin-to-spain wrote:

I suspect that probably selected candidates have been already contacted before publishing the first list is because in other regional calls (I had also this experience at international level) this is exactly what happens. Funding agency asks the candidates whether or not are willing to accept the grant, some of them reject the grant right away, so the funding agency can contact the rest of candidates, and speed up the process of hiring or allocating the grants. This way most of the people granted and appearing in the first list will accept the grant, meaning that they can show how attractive the grant is. This is an official mean to comunicate the results but it is of course not public. In comparison to many other similar calls, after publishing the definitive list of candidates and positions allocated to each centre, it takes little for the publication of the list of awardees.
This is why my feeling is that grantees have been or will be soon contacted officially but privately.
Unfortunately, I do not know anyone working in science in Andalucia to ask. I hope there will be more calls in the near future, it would make no sense to stop this program. However, I believe that there will be some kind of filter (like a co-funding host) in order to reduce the number of applicants.


berlin-to-spain wrote:

Hi Berlin-to-Spain,
I don't quite get the why the winners must have been already contacted. Did the convocatoria say something about a maximum date to publish the results (sorry I don't remember having read that), or do you know somebody who has been unofficially told that he or she has been selected.

Thanks,

berlin-to-spain wrote:

six months have passed since the deadline of the call.
I suspect that in order to speed up paperwork, etc... 'winners' have been already contacted by whoever is in charge of this call.
I bet the final list will come out after Easter, hopefully back-to-back with the new call.

mensajes: 76

the list of contracts per area is out. physics plus math plus chemistry get 5. in toyal. who thought yhis was a good system? bio alone gets more. damn

{QUOTE(thread_id=>123052)}

berlin-to-spain wrote:

I have never heard of such things happening systematically, especially here is Spain. The only similar thing I have heard of is some evaluator leaking the results to some applicants, but happening at particular level and completely independently from the organism, since it would be a huge breach of confidenciality. Here in Spain the procedures involve many steps, first they publish a provisional list of awardees, then there is a time for allegations/revisions where some awardee could decline, then there is another list of awardess where there may be some reserve candidates, and maybe yet another definitive list. Here in Spain the organisms don't care at all about the speed of the process or "prestige" of the calls, if half the candidates fail to sign the contracts then that money is lost (I mean, the organism simply "saves it") and that's it. If they would care about such things, the situation of science in Spain would be much different.

berlin-to-spain wrote:

I suspect that probably selected candidates have been already contacted before publishing the first list is because in other regional calls (I had also this experience at international level) this is exactly what happens. Funding agency asks the candidates whether or not are willing to accept the grant, some of them reject the grant right away, so the funding agency can contact the rest of candidates, and speed up the process of hiring or allocating the grants. This way most of the people granted and appearing in the first list will accept the grant, meaning that they can show how attractive the grant is. This is an official mean to comunicate the results but it is of course not public. In comparison to many other similar calls, after publishing the definitive list of candidates and positions allocated to each centre, it takes little for the publication of the list of awardees.
This is why my feeling is that grantees have been or will be soon contacted officially but privately.
Unfortunately, I do not know anyone working in science in Andalucia to ask. I hope there will be more calls in the near future, it would make no sense to stop this program. However, I believe that there will be some kind of filter (like a co-funding host) in order to reduce the number of applicants.


berlin-to-spain wrote:

Hi Berlin-to-Spain,
I don't quite get the why the winners must have been already contacted. Did the convocatoria say something about a maximum date to publish the results (sorry I don't remember having read that), or do you know somebody who has been unofficially told that he or she has been selected.

Thanks,

berlin-to-spain wrote:

six months have passed since the deadline of the call.
I suspect that in order to speed up paperwork, etc... 'winners' have been already contacted by whoever is in charge of this call.
I bet the final list will come out after Easter, hopefully back-to-back with the new call.

mensajes: 76



{QUOTE(thread_id=>123050)}I have never heard of such things happening systematically, especially here is Spain. The only similar thing I have heard of is some evaluator leaking the results to some applicants, but happening at particular level and completely independently from the organism, since it would be a huge breach of confidenciality. Here in Spain the procedures involve many steps, first they publish a provisional list of awardees, then there is a time for allegations/revisions where some awardee could decline, then there is another list of awardess where there may be some reserve candidates, and maybe yet another definitive list. Here in Spain the organisms don't care at all about the speed of the process or "prestige" of the calls, if half the candidates fail to sign the contracts then that money is lost (I mean, the organism simply "saves it") and that's it. If they would care about such things, the situation of science in Spain would be much different.

berlin-to-spain wrote:

I suspect that probably selected candidates have been already contacted before publishing the first list is because in other regional calls (I had also this experience at international level) this is exactly what happens. Funding agency asks the candidates whether or not are willing to accept the grant, some of them reject the grant right away, so the funding agency can contact the rest of candidates, and speed up the process of hiring or allocating the grants. This way most of the people granted and appearing in the first list will accept the grant, meaning that they can show how attractive the grant is. This is an official mean to comunicate the results but it is of course not public. In comparison to many other similar calls, after publishing the definitive list of candidates and positions allocated to each centre, it takes little for the publication of the list of awardees.
This is why my feeling is that grantees have been or will be soon contacted officially but privately.
Unfortunately, I do not know anyone working in science in Andalucia to ask. I hope there will be more calls in the near future, it would make no sense to stop this program. However, I believe that there will be some kind of filter (like a co-funding host) in order to reduce the number of applicants.


berlin-to-spain wrote:

Hi Berlin-to-Spain,
I don't quite get the why the winners must have been already contacted. Did the convocatoria say something about a maximum date to publish the results (sorry I don't remember having read that), or do you know somebody who has been unofficially told that he or she has been selected.

Thanks,

berlin-to-spain wrote:

six months have passed since the deadline of the call.
I suspect that in order to speed up paperwork, etc... 'winners' have been already contacted by whoever is in charge of this call.
I bet the final list will come out after Easter, hopefully back-to-back with the new call.

mensajes: 56

I have never heard of such things happening systematically, especially here is Spain. The only similar thing I have heard of is some evaluator leaking the results to some applicants, but happening at particular level and completely independently from the organism, since it would be a huge breach of confidenciality. Here in Spain the procedures involve many steps, first they publish a provisional list of awardees, then there is a time for allegations/revisions where some awardee could decline, then there is another list of awardess where there may be some reserve candidates, and maybe yet another definitive list. Here in Spain the organisms don't care at all about the speed of the process or "prestige" of the calls, if half the candidates fail to sign the contracts then that money is lost (I mean, the organism simply "saves it") and that's it. If they would care about such things, the situation of science in Spain would be much different.


{QUOTE(thread_id=>123035)}
I suspect that probably selected candidates have been already contacted before publishing the first list is because in other regional calls (I had also this experience at international level) this is exactly what happens. Funding agency asks the candidates whether or not are willing to accept the grant, some of them reject the grant right away, so the funding agency can contact the rest of candidates, and speed up the process of hiring or allocating the grants. This way most of the people granted and appearing in the first list will accept the grant, meaning that they can show how attractive the grant is. This is an official mean to comunicate the results but it is of course not public. In comparison to many other similar calls, after publishing the definitive list of candidates and positions allocated to each centre, it takes little for the publication of the list of awardees.
This is why my feeling is that grantees have been or will be soon contacted officially but privately.
Unfortunately, I do not know anyone working in science in Andalucia to ask. I hope there will be more calls in the near future, it would make no sense to stop this program. However, I believe that there will be some kind of filter (like a co-funding host) in order to reduce the number of applicants.


berlin-to-spain wrote:

Hi Berlin-to-Spain,
I don't quite get the why the winners must have been already contacted. Did the convocatoria say something about a maximum date to publish the results (sorry I don't remember having read that), or do you know somebody who has been unofficially told that he or she has been selected.

Thanks,

berlin-to-spain wrote:

six months have passed since the deadline of the call.
I suspect that in order to speed up paperwork, etc... 'winners' have been already contacted by whoever is in charge of this call.
I bet the final list will come out after Easter, hopefully back-to-back with the new call.

mensajes: 11


I suspect that probably selected candidates have been already contacted before publishing the first list is because in other regional calls (I had also this experience at international level) this is exactly what happens. Funding agency asks the candidates whether or not are willing to accept the grant, some of them reject the grant right away, so the funding agency can contact the rest of candidates, and speed up the process of hiring or allocating the grants. This way most of the people granted and appearing in the first list will accept the grant, meaning that they can show how attractive the grant is. This is an official mean to comunicate the results but it is of course not public. In comparison to many other similar calls, after publishing the definitive list of candidates and positions allocated to each centre, it takes little for the publication of the list of awardees.
This is why my feeling is that grantees have been or will be soon contacted officially but privately.
Unfortunately, I do not know anyone working in science in Andalucia to ask. I hope there will be more calls in the near future, it would make no sense to stop this program. However, I believe that there will be some kind of filter (like a co-funding host) in order to reduce the number of applicants.



{QUOTE(thread_id=>123032)}
Hi Berlin-to-Spain,
I don't quite get the why the winners must have been already contacted. Did the convocatoria say something about a maximum date to publish the results (sorry I don't remember having read that), or do you know somebody who has been unofficially told that he or she has been selected.

Thanks,

berlin-to-spain wrote:

six months have passed since the deadline of the call.
I suspect that in order to speed up paperwork, etc... 'winners' have been already contacted by whoever is in charge of this call.
I bet the final list will come out after Easter, hopefully back-to-back with the new call.

mensajes: 2

{QUOTE(thread_id=>123030)}six months have passed since the deadline of the call.
I suspect that in order to speed up paperwork, etc... 'winners' have been already contacted by whoever is in charge of this call.
I bet the final list will come out after Easter, hopefully back-to-back with the new call.



Hi Berlin-to-Spain,

do you (or anybody) know whether there would be a new EMERGIA call this year 2021??

Thanks a lot.

mensajes: 8


Hi Berlin-to-Spain,
I don't quite get the why the winners must have been already contacted. Did the convocatoria say something about a maximum date to publish the results (sorry I don't remember having read that), or do you know somebody who has been unofficially told that he or she has been selected.

Thanks,

{QUOTE(thread_id=>123030)}six months have passed since the deadline of the call.
I suspect that in order to speed up paperwork, etc... 'winners' have been already contacted by whoever is in charge of this call.
I bet the final list will come out after Easter, hopefully back-to-back with the new call.

mensajes: 76

i noted in a previous post that the Junta removed the "procedimiento de urgencia" woth somr lame excuse. so i dint think what youre sayijg is accurate

CityShrimp wrote:

six months have passed since the deadline of the call.
I suspect that in order to speed up paperwork, etc... 'winners' have been already contacted by whoever is in charge of this call.
I bet the final list will come out after Easter, hopefully back-to-back with the new call.


CityShrimp wrote:
CityShrimp wrote:
Please read the regulation. I'm not making it up. Theyll do the arithmetic mean between this percentage and the percentage of actual applicants. If it's a 20% in the FQM areas, then it'll be a 15% total, approx, so 6 (2 F, 2 Q and 2 M), still pretty ridiculous. Now check how many biologists and health "scientists" there are on the list.


Right, I forgot about that being in the regulations, don't be mad at me :-)

CityShrimp wrote:
And in case you thought i was thinking about the total number: I know, it's 40 grants total and those numbers are what you say, however, they use them to assign (in the way described in the previous message) the PERCENTAGE of grants per area. Given that phys math and chem go together (WHY???), we are talking 2 per area in the three quantitative (assuming chemistry is quantitative) sciences (assuming chem is a science).


== Sheldon Cooper seal of approval ==

Jokes aside, I did a quick count with the distribution and I got this (if I didn't screw up the numbers):

Area Number Percentage
FQM 400.115942
BIO550.15942
RNM570.165217
AGR370.107246
CTS570.165217
TIC210.0608696
SEJ180.0521739
TEP250.0724638
HUM350.101449
Total3451.0


So well, maybe 11.6% seems too small to you, but given that it will be weighted with the % of applicants, I think it's not that bad.

On the other hand, I also doubt this will mean that F, Q and M must get the same number of grants, maybe the actual list will be equilibrated in that sense, but not due to the regulations but simply because of the statistics (leaving aside any reasonable doubts some people may have about the total cleaniness and transparency of the process...)

mensajes: 11

six months have passed since the deadline of the call.
I suspect that in order to speed up paperwork, etc... 'winners' have been already contacted by whoever is in charge of this call.
I bet the final list will come out after Easter, hopefully back-to-back with the new call.


CityShrimp wrote:
CityShrimp wrote:
Please read the regulation. I'm not making it up. Theyll do the arithmetic mean between this percentage and the percentage of actual applicants. If it's a 20% in the FQM areas, then it'll be a 15% total, approx, so 6 (2 F, 2 Q and 2 M), still pretty ridiculous. Now check how many biologists and health "scientists" there are on the list.


Right, I forgot about that being in the regulations, don't be mad at me :-)

CityShrimp wrote:
And in case you thought i was thinking about the total number: I know, it's 40 grants total and those numbers are what you say, however, they use them to assign (in the way described in the previous message) the PERCENTAGE of grants per area. Given that phys math and chem go together (WHY???), we are talking 2 per area in the three quantitative (assuming chemistry is quantitative) sciences (assuming chem is a science).


== Sheldon Cooper seal of approval ==

Jokes aside, I did a quick count with the distribution and I got this (if I didn't screw up the numbers):

Area Number Percentage
FQM 400.115942
BIO550.15942
RNM570.165217
AGR370.107246
CTS570.165217
TIC210.0608696
SEJ180.0521739
TEP250.0724638
HUM350.101449
Total3451.0


So well, maybe 11.6% seems too small to you, but given that it will be weighted with the % of applicants, I think it's not that bad.

On the other hand, I also doubt this will mean that F, Q and M must get the same number of grants, maybe the actual list will be equilibrated in that sense, but not due to the regulations but simply because of the statistics (leaving aside any reasonable doubts some people may have about the total cleaniness and transparency of the process...)

mensajes: 56
CityShrimp wrote:
Please read the regulation. I'm not making it up. Theyll do the arithmetic mean between this percentage and the percentage of actual applicants. If it's a 20% in the FQM areas, then it'll be a 15% total, approx, so 6 (2 F, 2 Q and 2 M), still pretty ridiculous. Now check how many biologists and health "scientists" there are on the list.


Right, I forgot about that being in the regulations, don't be mad at me :-)

CityShrimp wrote:
And in case you thought i was thinking about the total number: I know, it's 40 grants total and those numbers are what you say, however, they use them to assign (in the way described in the previous message) the PERCENTAGE of grants per area. Given that phys math and chem go together (WHY???), we are talking 2 per area in the three quantitative (assuming chemistry is quantitative) sciences (assuming chem is a science).


== Sheldon Cooper seal of approval ==

Jokes aside, I did a quick count with the distribution and I got this (if I didn't screw up the numbers):

Area Number Percentage
FQM 400.115942
BIO550.15942
RNM570.165217
AGR370.107246
CTS570.165217
TIC210.0608696
SEJ180.0521739
TEP250.0724638
HUM350.101449
Total3451.0


So well, maybe 11.6% seems too small to you, but given that it will be weighted with the % of applicants, I think it's not that bad.

On the other hand, I also doubt this will mean that F, Q and M must get the same number of grants, maybe the actual list will be equilibrated in that sense, but not due to the regulations but simply because of the statistics (leaving aside any reasonable doubts some people may have about the total cleaniness and transparency of the process...)

mensajes: 76

And in case you thought i was thinking about the total number: I know, it's 40 grants total and those numbers are what you say, however, they use them to assign (in the way described in the previous message) the PERCENTAGE of grants per area. Given that phys math and chem go together (WHY???), we are talking 2 per area in the three quantitative (assuming chemistry is quantitative) sciences (assuming chem is a science).

JT84 wrote:

"Hmmm, if you say so based on the published distribution, I would not be that sure. I think that only serves to establish some maximum number of grants per area and center, while the final numbers will be surely way lower. E.g. in the RyC there are several unversities that ask for 1 in each area regardless of some areas being much more populated."

Please read the regulation. I'm not making it up. Theyll do the arithmetic mean between this percentage and the percentage of actual applicants. If it's a 20% in the FQM areas, then it'll be a 15% total, approx, so 6 (2 F, 2 Q and 2 M), still pretty ridiculous. Now check how many biologists and health "scientists" there are on the list.

QUOTE(thread_id=122880)}
CityShrimp wrote:

(Escribo en ingles que hay extranjeros en el foro ; ) )

No more info here. I havent heard either from anyone regarding DEVA evaLuation, so maybe that hasnt happened yet, who knows. A bit alarming (for me) that it looks like physics+chemistry+mathematics (FQM) might be getting around 10% of the grants only, given what the universities and research centres have asked for. Meaning for the three areas 4 grants, which would be rather ridiculous.


Hmmm, if you say so based on the published distribution, I would not be that sure. I think that only serves to establish some maximum number of grants per area and center, while the final numbers will be surely way lower. E.g. in the RyC there are several unversities that ask for 1 in each area regardless of some areas being much more populated.

Being that said, it is true that traditionally the typical allocation of a minimum number of grants for each area leads to some areas having much less success rate, but I guess we must live with it.

JT84 wrote:

Buenas a todos,
soy nuevo en el foro asi que pido perdon de antemano si meto la pata en algo.
Tengo una pregunta simple sobre las EMERGIA, se volverá a abrir otra convocatoria este año 2021? Es decir, va a ser una convocatoria anual?
Gracias de antemano.
Saludos!


I would be very surprised if there is another Emergia call this year. The Junta de Andalucia has a very long standing tradition in being completely chaotic with the science calls, and my impression is that they are completely conditioned by the political calendar. Let's wait first to see when the list with the awardees pops up...

{QUOTE}
mensajes: 76

"Hmmm, if you say so based on the published distribution, I would not be that sure. I think that only serves to establish some maximum number of grants per area and center, while the final numbers will be surely way lower. E.g. in the RyC there are several unversities that ask for 1 in each area regardless of some areas being much more populated."

Please read the regulation. I'm not making it up. Theyll do the arithmetic mean between this percentage and the percentage of actual applicants. If it's a 20% in the FQM areas, then it'll be a 15% total, approx, so 6 (2 F, 2 Q and 2 M), still pretty ridiculous. Now check how many biologists and health "scientists" there are on the list.

QUOTE(thread_id=>122880)}
CityShrimp wrote:

(Escribo en ingles que hay extranjeros en el foro ; ) )

No more info here. I havent heard either from anyone regarding DEVA evaLuation, so maybe that hasnt happened yet, who knows. A bit alarming (for me) that it looks like physics+chemistry+mathematics (FQM) might be getting around 10% of the grants only, given what the universities and research centres have asked for. Meaning for the three areas 4 grants, which would be rather ridiculous.


Hmmm, if you say so based on the published distribution, I would not be that sure. I think that only serves to establish some maximum number of grants per area and center, while the final numbers will be surely way lower. E.g. in the RyC there are several unversities that ask for 1 in each area regardless of some areas being much more populated.

Being that said, it is true that traditionally the typical allocation of a minimum number of grants for each area leads to some areas having much less success rate, but I guess we must live with it.

JT84 wrote:

Buenas a todos,
soy nuevo en el foro asi que pido perdon de antemano si meto la pata en algo.
Tengo una pregunta simple sobre las EMERGIA, se volverá a abrir otra convocatoria este año 2021? Es decir, va a ser una convocatoria anual?
Gracias de antemano.
Saludos!


I would be very surprised if there is another Emergia call this year. The Junta de Andalucia has a very long standing tradition in being completely chaotic with the science calls, and my impression is that they are completely conditioned by the political calendar. Let's wait first to see when the list with the awardees pops up...{QUOTE}

mensajes: 56
CityShrimp wrote:

(Escribo en ingles que hay extranjeros en el foro ; ) )

No more info here. I havent heard either from anyone regarding DEVA evaLuation, so maybe that hasnt happened yet, who knows. A bit alarming (for me) that it looks like physics+chemistry+mathematics (FQM) might be getting around 10% of the grants only, given what the universities and research centres have asked for. Meaning for the three areas 4 grants, which would be rather ridiculous.


Hmmm, if you say so based on the published distribution, I would not be that sure. I think that only serves to establish some maximum number of grants per area and center, while the final numbers will be surely way lower. E.g. in the RyC there are several unversities that ask for 1 in each area regardless of some areas being much more populated.

Being that said, it is true that traditionally the typical allocation of a minimum number of grants for each area leads to some areas having much less success rate, but I guess we must live with it.

JT84 wrote:

Buenas a todos,
soy nuevo en el foro asi que pido perdon de antemano si meto la pata en algo.
Tengo una pregunta simple sobre las EMERGIA, se volverá a abrir otra convocatoria este año 2021? Es decir, va a ser una convocatoria anual?
Gracias de antemano.
Saludos!


I would be very surprised if there is another Emergia call this year. The Junta de Andalucia has a very long standing tradition in being completely chaotic with the science calls, and my impression is that they are completely conditioned by the political calendar. Let's wait first to see when the list with the awardees pops up...

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